The Great John Ziegler / USC Confrontation [Updated] [Re-Updated]
I received your replies. Let me ask a more focused question. I'll grant you that Ziegler had no good argument to get in. I'll concede for the sake of argument that he could be lawfully asked to leave. My question is: if you had been in charge, would you have let him ask people questions in front of the communications school -- or asked him to leave? I.e. you say: "On the other hand -- for right or for wrong -- when Ziegler was asked repeatedly to leave the site because at that point he was an uninvited guest, he repeatedly refused." Well, that's what I want to know. Was it right or wrong for them to ask him to leave? Again, I'm not asking for a legal opinion, but how you would have handled it if it had been up to you. And would your answer be the same if he was there to ask questions that were supportive of Couric?"
I answer Patterico with the following:
"I was inside the awards ceremony at the time of the incident, so without hedging, I honestly don't know the precise facts surrounding Ziegler's actions or his requests or anything else he was doing outside.
If the only thing Ziegler or anyone else, wanted to do was to stand outside of the Davidson Conference Center on the USC campus and ask people questions as they came and went, he should absolutely have been allowed to do so and I would absolutely defend his right to do so. I see no reason to obstruct him. As far as I know, USC is an open campus and the First Amendment still has sway inside campus boundaries. You and I both know that under a change of circumstances, trespassing laws begin to apply but I want to be 100% clear that I don't have enough facts to make that determination. In direct response to your direct question, if I were in charge of the event and all Ziegler was doing was trying to interview folks as they came and went from the conference I would have bought him a coffee and gave him a donut and wished him good luck in his endeavors. Further, if he was there to actually report on the event and NOT to provoke a partisan confrontation or to stage a provocative scene for a documentary, I would have made sure he was allowed inside the room with the rest of the media. There was virtually no security in the modest banquet room where the event was held and the press that was present was free to come and go as they pleased. As to Couric, I couldn't care less what Ziegler or anyone else thinks of her work. I have written publicly of her several times and I don't believe it's ever been in a flattering context. This isn't a matter of ideology. It's a question of the tension between free exercise of first amendment rights and private property rights. This is hardly the first time that a journalist, or someone with journalistic pretensions (in the case of Ziegler) has run afoul of authorities in some murky legal area of access versus privacy. One thing is absolutely for sure: from what I saw in the video, the USC police could have made a more strenuous effort to remove Ziegler without going through the drama of handcuffing him. You know as a prosecutor that once given an order to move by police, even if an unjust or unlawful order, you MUST comply or else face arrest and be willing to sort the matter out later in court. They may have felt they had no choice to cuff him. Maybe they were wrong. But by that point it was either cuff or grab him and walk him off campus. The crux of the issue, to come full circle, is whether or not he was merely standing there trying to do interviews. If that's all it was, then USC is in the wrong. If it was more than that, there's a shared responsibility. " We report. You decide. I haven't spent much time on this and don't intend to beyond this posting. My anecdotal understanding is that this was not a simple situation of Ziegler merely standing on campus trying to ask questions. And to repeat one final time, the USC police may or may not have been acting properly to order him off campus. But once they did and he refused, the cuffing or some other act of coercion was more or less inevitable. ***** UPDATE: An official statement just came out from Annenberg Dean Ernest Wilson and it confirms what I suggested above...that this incident was more complex than simply tossing out Ziegler because he doesn't like Couric (Statement follows at bottom of the post).. He announced he was coming to protest and then showed up with cameras demanding to be let inside. Um, no. What I discern from yet another viewing of the video is that the police had wanted Ziegler to stay 7 feet away from the doors and if he did so there would have been no problem. He challenged the rule, refused to move and got gently cuffed and very politely escorted away though he was, in fact, mildly resisting. My conclusion stands that Ziegler was pulling off a publicity stunt. The demand that he stay seven feet distant seems a little rigid but reasonable. His refusal to comply was a direct provocation. The police responded poorly because he clearly represented no physical threat and was just being purposefully obstinate, hoping to goad the cops into action. I see no reason why the police could not have spent another 10 minutes persuading him to move before resorting to handcuffs. Though, my bet is that Ziegler would have held out as long as he needed to get himself detained. ***** RE-UPDATE Here's a blog post from pne of the most prominent student Republican activists (and I'm happy to say thinkers) at USC in which he labels Ziegler an "idiot" who is "wildly exaggerating" what happened. Josh Sharp also provides us even more context surrounding Ziegler's stunt and totally discredits any notion that Ziegler was in some form victimized or discriminated against. Ziegler simply tried to game this situation for his own advantage he got busted...quite literally. An excerpt from Sharp's post: In the days leading up to the event, Ziegler had announced his intention to protest the award. USC provided a gated space near the near the entrance of the event for demonstrators, but Ziegler and his film crew were the only ones to show up. So Ziegler started calling himself a journalist and demanding full access to the event. Conveniently enough, a film crew is on hand to document Ziegler's plight, either brought by Ziegler or hired for the occasion. Ziegler, microphone in hand, repeatedly tries to get university officials to say something controversial, pouncing at every opportunity and offering slanted commentary to the camera.
Meanwhile, Ziegler still refuses to move to the area provided for visiting demonstrators, ten feet away. After putting up with Ziegler for nearly an hour, campus police tell Ziegler that he's made his point and is no longer welcome on campus. Of course, the university is well within its rights; Ziegler is standing on private property.
Ziegler cries foul and resists arrest, grunting, "You guys realize you're breaking all sorts of constitut-- I'm not gonna move!"
He's promptly escorted off campus...
Read Sharp's entire post.
Meanwhile, here's a more complete video of the incident than the one found at the top of this post. I think it quite revealing. Ziegler is told directly that he is out of bounds by all pre-established procedures and that he is intent on crashing the event anyway.
Here's the statement from Annenberg Dean Ernie Wilson:
"In the last 24 hours, the School has received a number of calls and messages related to an incident that took place on Wednesday at the Cronkite Awards ceremony involving an individual named John Ziegler. Understandably, there has been confusion, questions and concerns. I want you to know the background of the situation.
In the days before his appearance on our campus, Mr. Ziegler publicly stated an intention to “demonstrate” against the presentation of a journalism award to Katie Couric. USC was happy to accommodate Ziegler and provided him with a designated area where he could register his protest, be seen by attendees at the event, as well as students, and pass out whatever materials he wished.
On the day of the award ceremony, Mr. Ziegler arrived on campus with two cameramen, not as a demonstrator, but as a journalist, and demanded that he and his cameramen be allowed to enter the Davidson Center to cover the event. There was in fact, pool coverage set up because the room was not large enough to accommodate multiple camera crews. He was told he could have that feed, which he refused. After being told repeatedly that the event was by invitation only, he contended he had a right to range up and down the entryway with his cameramen, sticking a microphone in other people's faces, questioning them on camera. He persisted in refusing to comply with the University’s request that he stay within a designated area. After repeated requests for compliance, Mr. Ziegler was given the choice of either being arrested or leaving campus.
He chose to leave campus.
The University both respects and facilitates freedom of speech and expression on campus, but also reserves the right to set reasonable ground-rules to avoid disruption to its operations and protect the rights of others. We at the Annenberg School have a powerful and evident commitment to protecting and promoting freedom of expression and the rights of the press. We have spoken with Martha Harris, Senior Vice President, University Relations, to express our concern with how Annenberg has been associated with this incident, and to discuss as well as our general philosophy on how these situations can be handled in the future.
If you have further questions or concerns, please feel free to contact James Grant in University Communications. In addition, if you are not already doing so, please refer any media queries about this issue to James Grant at james.grant@usc.edu ..."
Sincerely,
Ernest J. Wilson III
Dean and
Walter H. Annenberg Chair in Communication
----------------------------
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April 17th, 2009 at 3:01 pm
Ziegler is a beautiful human being, as Nate Silver discovered.
April 17th, 2009 at 3:18 pm
The ho haw is that the immediate reaction to anything has become to use force. Z is a predictable right wing ass hole. Its actually a shame with all those journalists there no one had a sense of humour– or iony (except Z, apparently) and should have had Katie and Z have it out. Now that would have been great spectator sport. But I suspect no one INSIDE really knew what the hell was going on outside. Too bad. If he had been allowed in then the real fun could have ensued.
It would have diffused his whole premise to have all those liberal shmucks show some game.
April 17th, 2009 at 4:48 pm
Marc – John Ziegler’s got nothing. In California, free speech & access rights in circumstances such as shown in the viedo stem not codified law, but rather from case law, resting heavily on the Pruneyard Decision (1979). That published case law has been heavily eroded, and the current standard for such activity that Mr. Ziegler sought to employee would be subjected to the fact he was on the USC campus, which I certain, any judge would deem as a “stand alone facility.” As such, the campus is under no obligation to permit him access at all. That’s why the campus police insisted he move his act to the sidewalk, where he could have had free reign to say/interview/antagonize to his heart’s content. His case is further limited in that USC did actually suggest “reasonable time, place, and manner” (i.e. 7 feet away from the doors. Note: any petition circulator or union picketer would have leaped for access within 7 feet of the doors). Mr. Ziegler’s burden also becomes heavier: he needs to prove that USC’s ‘time, place, and manner’ restrictions were unreasonable. And remember, USC did not even have to grant that.
Again, he’s got nothing.
April 17th, 2009 at 5:09 pm
He got exactly what he wanted, much as Michael Moore did in his many confrontations for film. It’s embarrassing to USC and the Journo School.
I hardly think the guy is looking for any sort of damages so the discussion above is moot.
April 17th, 2009 at 5:23 pm
I am faux-outraged that a faux-journalist was detained by faux-police.
April 17th, 2009 at 5:53 pm
ANNA.. u got it . no one I knew inside knew what was going on inside. Also, as you can see in the video, the COnference Center is a lightly trafficked part of campus. No one outside knew either.
April 17th, 2009 at 6:58 pm
The seven foot rule is a false assertion given the video I saw. JZ was easily multiple yards away from any entrance. He was also more than seven feet from the check-in table, which itself, was far more than seven feet away from the entrance.
At the time of the depicted confrontation with USC police, JZ was at no time anywhere near seven feet to any entrance. Despite his multiple pleadings to ascertain the boundaries that were being enforced by the arresting/handcuffing officers, there was no mention of a seven foot rule.
The bottom line is that so long as JZ did not block the ingress and egress of any guests, USC (and likely an Annenberg complainant) was horribly in the wrong. Until someone shows me the evidence that JZ blocked any access to anyone, the burden of proof is on USC. JZ has a video to prove his assertions that he peaceably assembled.
April 17th, 2009 at 7:25 pm
I’m trying to figure out how this guy has a beef with “advocacy journalism.” Also, he should have lost the grin. I would have given his footage more impact. The university and the cops were dicks – total over-reaction.
April 17th, 2009 at 7:33 pm
Ziegler’s an ass (though some of his work amuses me as a conservative) but a technical question here.
Are USC “cops” sworn CA Peace Officers? USC is a private school; so really they’re private security with the same “arrest” powers as you or me, no?
April 17th, 2009 at 7:33 pm
Marc, et al, hope y’all caught Bill Moyers tonight. I came in last 15 minutes or so (after all the House reruns over) and a very cool guy journalist/now tv producer, David Simon, was on talking a lot of good shit about the state of journalism. I think his take pretty on the spot. He apparently produced The Wire on HBO (from few scenes shown looks not so good–but concept sounds good and just all youses allies)
I think you can always go back to the Bill Moyers website on PBS and watch programs that have aired.
April 17th, 2009 at 7:34 pm
By the way I am sure Ziegler’s film will be almost as funny as the photographers trying to rough it up with burly bad-ass Maguire Partners security in front of office towers downtown.
April 17th, 2009 at 7:49 pm
I don’t go where I’m not invited. I learned not to do that when I was about ten. Maybe Ziegler can learn the same someday.
This is the physical equivalent of being a troll.
April 17th, 2009 at 7:59 pm
Anna – Simon was one of the best urban reporters and is currently one of the best writers of dramatic television of his generation. He wrote the non-fiction books that the Homicide series and The Corner mini-series were based on, wrote and consulted for those shows and then created The Wire, which is the best dramatic series ever IMHO. Thanks for that heads up – I love Simon. I always record Moyers – going to check it out right now.
April 17th, 2009 at 8:02 pm
Just for the record, if John Ziegler were being honored somewhere and Katie Couric decided to enter the private property where he was and was subsequently asked to leave, I would not object to similar treatment by the relevant authorities should she refuse to comply.
April 17th, 2009 at 8:03 pm
Obligatory punchline: “Couldn’t even get himself arrested”
I used to listen to Ziegler for a couple of minutes on occasion, and he just wasn’t interesting. He did have a modest talent for trying to stir up arguments, but for some reason had the idiotic idea that he could make a name for himself and build an audience by picking fights with John and Ken who host the show of the same name. Since J&K are the backbone of the KFI skeleton (or certainly were at the time), Ziegler didn’t do himself a lot of favors career-wise.
He seems to be floundering around trying to rebuild a career as a right wing spokesman, in an era when there are already plenty of them and in which the right wing arguments aren’t being met with a lot of new converts.
Perhaps the only thing of interest about Ziegler is that he was the subject of the story on talk radio published in the Atlantic, in a style that mimicked internet hyperlinks.
April 17th, 2009 at 8:08 pm
Ed
As Patterico — a conservative and a prosecutor concedes– whether one likes it or not, USC can invoke private property rights and it can bar anyone it chooses from a campus event… espcially when that person has announced publicly that he he come to protest it. I have been on dozens of union picket lines where the employers have obtained injunctions that keep protestors a LONG distance from the private site and the cops have been there to bust you if you’re off by one inch.
If Zeigler was treated unfairly, I suppose he can sue USC for millions of dollars. So the ball is in his court. Meanwhile he — a virtual nobody and a clown– has reaped millions of dollars of worth free media with his stunt. Here I am wasting time talking about him when, in effect, very little happened. You would have to concede that while the handcuffing might have been over the tops, the demeanor of the USC police was pretty calm and laid back.
Mayor Sam:
You raise an interesting question for which I — for the moment– dont have the answer. I suspect that the USC police in fact have more authority than a private security force. But I might be wrong and until you raised the question I’ve never thought about it. Now I will.
April 17th, 2009 at 8:14 pm
reserves the right to set reasonable ground-rules to avoid disruption
What disruption?
So, the Annenberg school did sic the police on him. No one complained. Just wait until the ACLU takes up his case.
April 17th, 2009 at 8:28 pm
Marc, something in the story indicated to me that the USC, hob-nail booted, zip-tie wielding storm troopers cannot arrest anyone but may detain them for the police to make an arrest. But, this is the internet, so there’s a slight chance that some aspect of this information may be wrong.
April 17th, 2009 at 8:35 pm
Marc – did Patterico call you up to ask you what you thought about the torture memos ?
USC was totally within their rights and Ziegler was deliberately creating a provocation – but you’d think a media saavy outfit, or anyone with common sense, would realize that a trap was being set and that this guy was best gently ignored and not offered a photo op.
I would love to be reading Woody’s posts if Michael Moore or some pro-gay marriage activists had crashed an awards ceremony on the private property of Liberty University. On second thought…no I wouldn’t. But it’s a point worth invoking in order to call attention to the industrial strength hypocrisy of this clownish troll.
April 17th, 2009 at 8:41 pm
The real outrage here is that Katie Couric was given an award. Seriously, what has she done? Asked Palin a few softball question, none of which she could answer. Aren’t all reporters supposed to do that? How does that make her special? And, when so many talented reporters are losing their jobs, isn’t her salary – for a job that requires little more than reading cue cards – a little obscene? How many investigative reporters could be hired with a fraction of her salary?
April 17th, 2009 at 8:47 pm
reg, liberals crash conservative events all the time. Think about how many conservative speakers have been shouted down on college campuses and not allowed to speak by radical leftist students.
This happened at UNC the other day when lefty students shouted down Rep. Trancado and destroyed school property.
Video and Opinion
Maybe I would have heard your outrage on this if the mainstream liberal media covered things like this.
April 17th, 2009 at 9:05 pm
[...] Marc Cooper » Blog Archive » The Great John Ziegler / USC … « Wireless Home Stereo Speakers Digital Amplifier » [...]
April 17th, 2009 at 10:31 pm
wow. i had no idea this happened! that part of campus is nowhere near Annenberg!
Marc – kudos to you for this blog post and keeping the process transparent.
amazing stuff here.
April 18th, 2009 at 9:47 am
USC did actually suggest “reasonable time, place, and manner” (i.e. 7 feet away from the doors.
If you saw the video you know how ridiculous this statement is. Whatever your opinion of Ziegler, you seem to think that determines the correct response. Political speech has certainly atrophied at SC since I graduated. What a sad little parody of a communications education exists at SC. I actually got a very good education in a day when some classes were in barracks and I never had any idea what my professors’ political views were. Of course, I was a science major and I guess that makes all the difference.
Michael Kennedy 1960, MD 1966.
April 18th, 2009 at 9:56 am
I followed Woody’s link and it’s pretty odd support for the rights of protesters. It includes some students chanting “Shame on You” at Tom Tancredo and some students getting tazed when they don’t clear out of the way. It’s possible that Woody is saying the police should have tazed Zeigler, but it’s more likely that he has no opinion whatsoever on the rights of protesters and just thinks that constitutional rights depend on your political party.
April 18th, 2009 at 10:25 am
“As Patterico — a conservative and a prosecutor concedes– whether one likes it or not, USC can invoke private property rights and it can bar anyone it chooses from a campus event.”
Actually, if you read the line from the private e-mail I sent you that you republished here, you’ll see I conceded it “for the sake of argument.” I have specifically refrained from expressing an opinion on the legal issues publicly, for good reasons. So please don’t take that line in my e-mail as a public expression of my opinion regarding USC’s legal rights. It not intended to be an expression of a legal opinion.
By issuing this clarification I am not saying that USC *didn’t* have that right either. I am just saying that I am not taking a public position on that. I conceded it “for the sake of argument” in order to focus your answer on another issue that I found more interesting.
April 18th, 2009 at 11:04 am
objection sustained.
April 18th, 2009 at 11:37 am
John Ziegler is a moron supreme who luckily has an admirer in Matt Drudge.
April 18th, 2009 at 12:01 pm
The USC Annenberg School for Communism has achieved another milestone in promoting “One Sided journalism” by handcuffing reporters and ordering the cameras and microphones silenced as they present Katie Couric an award for deceptive editing and helping to destroy a dire threat from a philosophical and political enemy of the left.
Marc appears to be a hapless accomplice to the hand-cuffing of John Ziegler, but who can blame him with the job situation as it is. Needless to say if it was Marc getting handcuffed, he would have a different take on the situation.
The Annenberg School has lost all credibility in my eyes, and just appears to be another left wing organization that would use force to subdue their political enemies like all the dictators of the past.
After viewing the full video it was clear that John Ziegler never tried to enter the building nor block entrance, and was there just to ask questions of people entering the award ceremony. He was overwhelmingly successful in exposing this hypocrisy of the school.
Couric/CBS Erases Quotes from Palin Interview/Transcript.
http://www.iris.org.il/blog/archives/2887-CBS-News-Erases-Moderate-Quotes-from-Palin-Transcript.html
April 18th, 2009 at 12:39 pm
Pokey:.
Try to see the incident for what it is: cops–even low rent security guards hired to trawl and troll institutional and business campuses are always over zealous and lover trying prove they can still get hard.
I don’t think anyone gave anybody any instructions in this situation other than a few well known high rent TV personalities were on the premises and of course “protecting” their sorry asses is what matters as they are worth a lot of money.
Look…an old panty waste bloated caricature of a security guard rigged up in what looks like state trooper regalia huffs and puffs around the historic train depot which is also a bus transfer point in my area. Havent you seen these shtuppers? They are always looking to be a real cop and push people around.
And then there are the real cops who push a loan poor bastard to the ground for no reason– and he dies. (Ian Tomlinson)
Its an expression of one’s inner nazi. a lot of people have it and they often take those type of jobs. they like to huff and puff if not have an excuse to kill someone.
This isnt the Annenbergy School loosing “all its credibility”. This would have happened at a MacDonalds.
Its part of the psycho network–the glue that keeps our cute free market economy going. Anyone perceived as a threat to the status quo in any fashion is threatened.. The joke is the SC fat butts for hire probably share more of their personal sympathies with a Ziegler ( or you) than they do with any liberal anything.
Its just a matter of human nature. stop blowing this up into something you can ride steely eyed on the great soviet train of destiny on. get a grip.
April 18th, 2009 at 1:38 pm
Anna,
First, I am a USC graduate, so I particularly familiar with the campus and the campus police. In my entire attendance (during the middle of the Viet Nam era), I never saw the campus police arrest or put anyone in handcuffs.
What disturbs me is not what the campus cops did; it is that after huddling and discussing the issue with MANAGEMENT, they decided to remove what they felt was a POLITIAL trouble maker.
If it was one cop out of control, I would chalk this up to human behavior of a low paid campus security cop. But this was instead, Annenberg Managements poorly thought out reaction to a perceived political threat.
April 18th, 2009 at 2:09 pm
Wow!: Sounds like Anna’s defending (however back-handedly) Ziegler.
Meanwhile, Gustavo– whom I consider myself a fan of– is dismissing JZ out of hand without regard to the facts (however they hash out).
Life doesn’t make sense anymore…
April 18th, 2009 at 2:57 pm
its all much ado about nothing other than its just one more symptom of how elusive and illusionary democracy is.
The reason the rent a thugs were brought to bear was because– like I said–Couric, Stephanapoulous and I forget what other high rent media property were in attendance.
Its all about protecting property. Get over it or hit the barricades.
and how i could sound like i was defending JZ– who frankly I wished they’d kicked in his teeth–is beyond me.
He’s like a cockroach. Sometimes you need to just step on one even tho another will take its place.
April 18th, 2009 at 3:00 pm
“my experience in the world is that, whatever your motivation, when you refuse a police order to move, you usually wind up getting cuffed, or worse.”
****
Mine too.
Zieg is a freak – this is what he wanted – people who would otherwise brush away his crazy like an uwanted fly are talking about him.
April 18th, 2009 at 3:02 pm
To muddy further this silly debate: JZ thought he had a right to protest a private recognition of someone as if there was some civil right being violated. based on his daft assumption that some dopey award means anything– it wasnt the congressional medal of honor–the school had a right to kick his ass out. he wasnt there to be a polite attendee. No one owed him anything and he thought they did.
he was rude. as far as i am concerned you can kick someone’s ass out for being rude. his attention was to be rude and disruptive.
April 18th, 2009 at 3:02 pm
rather his “intention” …oops
April 18th, 2009 at 3:05 pm
and who gives a shit about the walter cronkite award. Cronkite was a windbag and hypocrite. I met one of his daughters. nuff said
April 18th, 2009 at 3:13 pm
good god, i thought walter was dead. he’s not.
if there was an Edward R Murrow award or journalism schools named after him it might all mean something. Instead there seems to be these McCronkite centers.
April 18th, 2009 at 4:35 pm
“Cronkite was a windbag and hypocrite. I met one of his daughters. nuff said”
Indeed Anna. So would you please.
April 18th, 2009 at 5:33 pm
“Ché voler ciò udire è bassa voglia.”…
John Ziegler, you’ll remember, considers tragic suicide the perfect occasion for self-promotion, so his recent antics should come as no surprise. Here’s what happened:
He announced that he would demonstrate the Walter Cronkite Award for Ex…
April 18th, 2009 at 7:00 pm
Pokey
I think ur a bit overwrought about this. Given that us own sister works at Annenberg I don’t really think it’s a nest of Commie/Nazis taking pleasure in locking up talk radio clowns.
Cops are cops. In this case, as it turns out, they had spent more than hour telling this guy and they simly had enough. Actually from what I can discern in the video, the decision to finally cuff this toad and move him out came from a USC university PR exec and not from anyone at Annenberg. Not that it matters.
This is a whole bunch of palaver about a stunt .. and one in which there was no real damage incurred by anyone, except for the humiliation for a few minutes that Ziegler acvtively sought
If u were genuinely interested in righting the wrongs inflicted on journalists I could offer u a long list of much more important abuses. But why bother? We all know that you think the media and journalists are the problem and huddle everyday to brainwash the American people into socialism.
Yawn.
Were u equally upset a couple of years ago when UCLA campus police tasered an Iranian students who wouldnt comply with an order to show his ID in the library at night??? Oh… wait… he was a Muslim.
April 18th, 2009 at 7:46 pm
Marc,
Thanks for clarifying for everyone that this was not the decision of some overzealous rent a cop, but in fact some overzealous management PR type at USC, which comforts me some that it wasn’t the Annenberg School of Communication management.
And No, I don’t think the school is a nest of Commie/Nazis, however, USC should be ashamed of their actions, and if there was an apology, I have missed it.
But, instead of an apology, all I hear, is he’s a Toad (who in no way commits journalism).
The Prima Facie evidence suggests that the University tends to only promote freedom of speech and expression on campus as long as it does not make them look bad.
I just think that a School of Journalism should have higher standards, and righting wrongs inflicted on journalists is hardly the issue as you well know.
April 18th, 2009 at 9:37 pm
Mavis, the student activists accomplished their goal at UNC – blocking a conservative from speaking, which was the wrong. That’s the lesson that you should have learned. The heckling and disruptions and violence that block conservative speakers on campuses is a disgrace.
Liberals, who control college campuses, will do whatever it takes to silence voices that would expose their failured philosophies and their hypocrisy.
This is a broader issue than just stopping one conservative journalist, but it is serious when entire universities strive to stop conservatives and to intimidate students who hold conservative views.
SIMIAN STUDENTS THROW FECES AT CONSERVATIVE SPEAKERS
(That last paragraph descibes reg to a tea.)
There is no doubt in my mind at all that the Annenberg school would not have taken an measures against students or left-wing journalists in a similar situation if they were on the outside. What a disgrace.
April 18th, 2009 at 10:04 pm
To answer the question posed earlier, USC Public Safety Officers have arrest and other selected powers as delineated in a Memorandum of Understanding with the LAPD. So yes, Ziegler could be arrested for failure to comply with the PSO’s orders.
April 18th, 2009 at 10:22 pm
Woody, it would be interesting — maybe– to learn how u actually believe that liberals somehow got together and took over the administration of America’s universities? When and how did that happen? The same time month the moon turned to Green CHeese?
In fact, American university administrators are reknown for their caution and conservativism.
USC is particular isby every measure a relatively conservative campus and it administration is much more oriented toward business than toward radical social change.
Incidentally, the only dramatic political act I can recall on campus in the last decade was about 3 years ago. A group of about 15 or so students staged a sit in in the President’s office over an issue of the university’s alleged connection with sweatshops.
Within minutes, in front of the students, the administrators got on their cell phones and called the kids’ parents and told them if they didn’t immediately desist they would be expelled for good (and out 40K worth of tuition). The students loudly bitched and complained but packed their stuff up and went home defeated.
You’re living in a fantasy world. If it comforts you to actually believe that pinkos have taken over the schools, by all means, don’t let me stop you. But you are really deluded about this.
April 18th, 2009 at 10:27 pm
Pokey… all institutions shun bad publicity. Do I think USC is any different? No. Neither is the Heritage Foundation. Or the Bush or Obama White Houses.
USC has nothing to apologize for.
There are some of us, like urs truly, who are willing to concede that, as I said in my original, post, the authorities handled it all rather poorly.
No, why don’t you man up and be honest enough to concede the painfully obvious point that ZIegler is NOT a journalist, that his prime motivation was to grandstand and cause a scene and that is exactly what he did. Climb down off the high horse and save your outrage and energy for something and somebody worth your trouble. Even the leading USC student Republican wrote a column calling Ziegler an “idiot” and accusing him of “wildly exaggerating.” I know ur having fun doing this, as I am, but intellectually honest enough to admit that Ziegler is a bozo and if an leftist had come to the event with the same intention of disrupting it, he too would have been barred and booted. Get serious.
April 18th, 2009 at 10:46 pm
I was interested in the information that calwatch provided about USC’s MOU with the LAPD, which appears to be accurate. The 2006 – 2008 comment thread linked below, starting about 1/3 down, shows that the understanding imposes limits and minimum requirements for all USC officers, and that the understanding can be and was once suspended by the LAPD Chief of Police.
Police Forums – USC DPS(Dept. of Public safety) just got SCREWED by Bratton and Co ( LAPD) who shut down their MOA,effectively stopping their arrest authority per 830.7 (b) of the CA. penal code. There is some issue toward reinstating the MOA.USC DPS officers attend Rio Hondo Regional Police academy….
Also, here is the daily report log for 4/15/09 from the USC officers. There were two disturbing the peace incidents on that day, which are listed together. The treatment of 40 protesting students resulted in them getting what they wanted but the treatment of the journalist was to ban him from campus.
USC Public Safety Log Report
I don’t really think that Ziegler was a threat in any way and that the order to run him off was a feigned overreaction just because of his conservative position.
April 18th, 2009 at 11:04 pm
Marc: Woody, it would be interesting — maybe– to learn how u actually believe that liberals somehow got together and took over the administration of America’s universities? …If it comforts you to actually believe that pinkos have taken over the schools, by all means, don’t let me stop you. But you are really deluded about this.
What’s more important is that the left actually did take over campuses rather than how they did it. There’s no delusion over this. If anything, you’re in denial.
There is overwhelming evidence of this, such as polls of professors and the commie bulletin boards at the Student Unions.
This weekend I’m at the University of Alabama, where football coaches are held to higher standards than professors. Let a professor be sorry, spout left-wing ideology, or ridicule conservative students, he can still keep his job through tenure. Let a head coach lose a couple of times to Auburn, then he’s given the boot. Dump tenure.
BTW, Chief Ward Churchill is back on the warpath.
April 19th, 2009 at 1:34 am
J.Z. couldn’t act out of a wet paper bag if he wanted too. Smiling at the camera isn’t brutality. What he needed to do was to start yelling ATTICA, ATTICA, ATTICA. It would been priceless.
April 19th, 2009 at 4:16 am
It’s rich that the infantile narcissistic troll – desperate for attention and piling mountains of delusional drivel in serial, repetitive comments – has to project his emotional and mental incompetence on to others.
April 19th, 2009 at 7:43 am
Marc,
Of Course all institutions and politicians shun bad publicity, but I think everyone would agree that this would not have happened at a UC campus unless Ziegler was carrying a bomb or a Gun.
However I will grant you that John Ziegler was there to GRANDSTAND and specifically promote his latest documentary called “Media Malpractice” which deals with the Katie Couric interview of Sarah Palin. Ziegler interviewed Palin in her home about her experience with the media and with Couric for this DVD which he was attempting to hand out to people entering the award and get their comment on tape.
I will also admit that John Ziegler is about a serious journalist as Michael Moore is. Both tend to use the same confrontational / grandstanding methods.
But the real point is that he did not try to get in the building after he was refused access or block anyone’s entrance to the event.
The Police acted as ordered by management so I can’t fault them for that, except when they demanded that the Video tape be turned off, and then physically assaulted the cameraman to turn it off when the cameraman did not comply.
I believe we can agree that if the campus police had refused him admittance and just ignored him this would likely have been a non-event, and Ziegler would not have made FOX news.
If USC was NOT a private campus this wouldn’t have happened, which is depressing because in these type of Matters USC should act like a public institution instead of like some greedy corporation that is hiding something.
April 19th, 2009 at 7:52 am
Woody, would you get that stick out of your ass– even tho we all know you enjoy the feeling of it being there…
There was a time when just to practically mention the word communism–even in a the requisite Poli Sci 1 course–could cause the sky to fall on an instructor. The right has had far more influence over institutions than liberals ever have. Just once..ONCE drop the horse shit of your selective umbrage.
And, frankly, right wing idiots should be shouted down. I am all for it. its freedom of speech. if someone says something stupid– they should have to take the rap.
April 19th, 2009 at 8:08 am
Anna C: And, frankly, right wing idiots should be shouted down. I am all for it.
Your right wing idiot is usually a principled leader or speaker.
Unlike the Democratic Party, conservatives don’t try to keep you darkies on the political plantation.
April 19th, 2009 at 8:12 am
Like the NYT, the administration of almost all universities is better thought of as an “Establishment” institution, not a “Liberal” one.
Even in its weakened form today, the term “Liberal” does entail some non-negotiable political positions. That’s not the mindset of administrations — any kind of politics would be purely vestigial. They mainly want to keep things rolling along smoothly, so that more buildings can be planned, grants funded, alumni feted, strategic hires made, and careers built.
In this context, “radicalism” is founding a new department or hiring a cross-disciplinary professor.
Nothing really wrong with this; some of those decisions can indeed prove radical, over time. It’s just important to realize that, in the context, an accusation of “leftism” is untenable, a fantasy.
April 19th, 2009 at 8:13 am
Marc.
Apparently Woody has never heard of the one time president of my alma mater – and one term loser senator – S. I. (Sleeping Sam) Hayakawa.
April 19th, 2009 at 8:44 am
Marc, Woody’s last comment reminded me once again to remind you to extrapolate all of Woody’s comments ( must be an application that allows you to choose a poster’s comments like you can do in a data base thingy?); print and you can either create a cute book to sell; create a performance piece or sell them to comedy writers.
Seriously. The guy is a gold mine. And I suspect that anything posted on your blog is your property to exploit?
April 19th, 2009 at 9:52 am
PS: You remember the Poetry of Donald Rumsfeld?
For those who missed this:
http://www.slate.com/id/2081042/
April 19th, 2009 at 12:58 pm
I would like to know if USC receives federal tax dollars. If so, the notion that they are a “private” institution rendered ridiculous.
April 19th, 2009 at 1:33 pm
I would like to know if USC receives federal tax dollars. If so, the notion that they are a “private” institution rendered ridiculous.
Rick Perry was a cotton farmer receiving federal subsidies before he became governor of Texas. By your logic, his farm would not be a private business.
April 19th, 2009 at 2:23 pm
If u were genuinely interested in righting the wrongs inflicted on journalists I could offer u a long list of much more important abuses.
This would be a good place to start.
April 19th, 2009 at 3:58 pm
This Ziegler character was too extreme even for KFI …
April 19th, 2009 at 4:01 pm
If you managed to learn something about universities, you would know that virtually all receive some form of governmental funding, either for research — a very big part of the picture — or in the form of aid to students.
USC is actually a rather conservative university.
No one is going to confuse USC with UC, which is, as you may or may not know, a public university.
># Mike Says:
April 19th, 2009 at 12:58 pm
I would like to know if USC receives federal tax dollars. If so, the notion that they are a “private” institution rendered ridiculous.
April 19th, 2009 at 4:09 pm
It would be interesting — maybe– to learn how u actually believe that liberals somehow got together and took over the administration of America’s universities? When and how did that happen? The same time month the moon turned to Green Cheese?
Obviously, Marc, the word <a href=”http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/23/opinion/23auster.html1968 isn’t going to mean a lot to you. But I thought I might mention it anyway.
It’s quite amazing how much chutzpah a man can build up when not his entire career, but his entire industry, is founded on systematic mendacity.
Although somehow I suspect even Duranty would have had too much dignity to make the centerpiece of his campaign against antigovernment protestors a middle-school sex joke. All I can say, Marc, is: I hope you’re enjoying the coeds, cocaine and Courvoisier while you’ve got ‘em. Mene, mene, tekel upharsin.
April 19th, 2009 at 6:06 pm
Do people like “Mencius” actually have functioning cerebral cortexes, are is their typing some sort of spasm ?
April 19th, 2009 at 6:07 pm
ooops…”or” not “are”
April 19th, 2009 at 7:14 pm
@Mencius:
Marc was talking about administration, not students.
And unless someone is taking ABD to a whole new level, there aren’t any sixty-eighters like Auster enrolled now.
April 19th, 2009 at 8:09 pm
I think all that wingnut welfare is biting the GOP on its flabby hind quarter…
April 19th, 2009 at 8:39 pm
reg, I see I’ve come to some sort of hotbed of philosophical discourse. Why, I could be in the original Grove, with Plato.
Apparently my HTML tags are some sort of spasm. As for the content, feel free to try my blog. Don’t worry – it’s all spasm-generated.
(Actually, I also like to teabag while I’m spasming. Do slip your well-pruned plums between my spastic gums, reg. I’ll be quite gentle, unless of course it’s a grand mal…)
April 19th, 2009 at 8:59 pm
Michael, what do you think the long-haired hoodlums of ’68 were taking over? The dorms? No, the dean’s office.
Sure, they left. Unpunished and victorious. They won, and power flowed into their hands. It’s always fun to win. For who are the deans of today? The Hayakawas, or the Third World Strikers The Grayson Kirks, or the Bill Ayerses?
Imagine the short-haired hoodlums of Youth for Western Civilization (“Est. 2008″) pulling the same. Imagine them winning! Scary! But fortunately, you don’t have to imagine it, because you’re in and they’re out. It’ll stay that way, too.
Bear in mind: both Hayakawa and Kirk were liberals, too. Just a different generation of liberals. Erik von Kuehnelt-Leddihn wasn’t exactly in the picture, let alone Maistre, Carlyle or Froude. (I’m afraid that if your “A” game has trouble with Patterico, let alone Fox News, you’re not going to be laying a lot of glove on Froude.)
And, of course, no one is taking over the dean’s office now. Why would they? They’re already there. It’s the fate of all revolutions. Victory is the death of revolutionary passion. Every Chernenko is a Lenin in his speeches, and that’s all the soixante-huitards are today: ancient, gray apparatchiks, clinging to their hard-won pension plans.
Which are perfectly secure, albeit a little underfunded. The Marc Coopers of the world need fear neither teabaggers nor talk-show hosts, fratboys nor Junkers, Mormons nor CEOs. The American right is a joke. Fox News is about as dangerous to your lives and livelihoods as the White-Guard emigres were to Chernenko’s.
No: the only surviving enemy of progressivism is emphysema. And it can’t come soon enough for some of us.
April 20th, 2009 at 1:18 am
Mencius:
You write: All I can say, Marc, is: I hope you’re enjoying the coeds, cocaine and Courvoisier while you’ve got ‘em.
You omitted my C-6 Corvette Z-51 convertible, dude. I enjoy that the most! Now, wipe the spittle from your lips and have a nice, double Cordon Bleu to calm yourself down.
April 20th, 2009 at 2:23 am
I read your blog a bit Mencius – you’re not in a grove. You’re jerking yourself off in spasms of puerile pretension – sorry. Of course, if Plato came up with that brilliant emphysema line I’d have a killer come back in the spirit of your remarkable typing. Perhaps something about his mother.
Unfortunately you proved my point.
April 20th, 2009 at 2:39 am
Mencius is Glenn Beck with footnotes and solitude.
April 20th, 2009 at 6:52 am
The important lesson in the ‘Ziegler Affair’ is not the bounds of free speech at public private institutions. It is the bounds of what constitutes a Journalist.
Here you have a highly political Palin loving little twit with a right-wing axe to grind planning on making a seen at a left-wing event in order to try to get on the news by making the news calling himself an honest Journalist trying to report an event.
On the other side we have the Rosegan Affair. A highly political Obama loving little twit with a left-wing axe to grind planning on making a seen at a right-wing event in order to try to influence a news story for left-wing political advantage, and actually hired by a major network as a Journalist.
Unfortunately for the profession of Journalism, this is the real story. Many times blatant political reporting/writing on news item, as in these two cases, but more often less obvious. The American people can no longer, and do no longer trust a Journalist to tell the whole truth, to tell them both sides of an issue. Their trust and favorably rating is near the bottom of professions respected by ordinary people. More and more people find it necessary to go to the internet in order to get both sides/interpretations on a news story.
This is the larger reason, imo, printed news material is on the road to bankruptcy. Because it’s trust and reader loyalty has been bankrupted by political agendas.
April 20th, 2009 at 6:55 am
Mmmmm guy: man, you need to get laid.
April 20th, 2009 at 6:55 am
…by the political agendas of its so-called Professional Journalists.
April 20th, 2009 at 7:51 am
Perhaps you should keep that match away from the strawman. Good thing you teach “journalism” and not debate.
April 20th, 2009 at 8:10 am
Marc,
I love the refreshing honesty!
It’s like that Obama-Chavez mutual grin. Impossible to fake. Look at the orbicularis on both of them. That’s a genuine eye-smile. Two great crooks, recognizing each other as masters. David Chase couldn’t have cast it better. (Not to mention the Revolutionary Drug Brother handshake!)
Eco-puritanism is so tired. What America needs is a one-party state whose apparatchiks know how to have a good time. I’m starting to sense that we finally have one.
April 20th, 2009 at 8:38 am
reg,
“Glenn Beck with footnotes.” I do hope you haven’t copyrighted that. As for the solitude, all I can say is that Carlyle didn’t have a one-year-old.
For you, I feel there is no pussyfooting required. Go straight to the main vein. Chase that with Froude’s Bow of Ulysses. And then watch the greatest documentary of all time: Africa Addio.
This is a treatment you can take in one evening. For ideal results: try it on acid. A hundred mikes of Switzerland’s best. Better yet – two hundred. The fundamental question here, reg, is: are you a man, or a boy? Is that hair on your balls, or is it just brown Silly String? Forgive me for suspecting the latter.
April 20th, 2009 at 9:15 am
M Le Maudit says: ” And then watch the greatest documentary of all time: Africa Addio.
That drec u mentory, A/A was so bad…’ the protests against “Africa Addio” are regarded as being the first anti-racist movement in German history.’
April 20th, 2009 at 9:57 am
M is like Ted Kaczynski’s evil twin. Ted’s manifesto was at least sane…and made sense.
April 20th, 2009 at 9:59 am
So you’ve seen it, Anna! How did you like the zebra scene?
And how about Zanzibar? I’ll bet, before you watched Africa Addio, you didn’t know there could be such a thing as professionally-made, 35mm, color, helicopter shots of a real, live, in-progress genocide. In fact, I’ll double the stakes and bet that you’d never even heard of the massacre of the Arabs in Zanzibar.
But you have now, because you saw Africa Addio! Gotta to love those anti-racist Germans – always so careful to look into a matter, before they develop an opinion about it.
Africa Addio was made in 1966 by the great Italian directors, Jacopetti and Prosperi – who are better known for Mondo Cane, but who regard AA as their best work.
If you do actually watch it, Anna, (for you, too, the Sandoz is not optional), you’ll see documentary techniques that are now routine, but that didn’t start showing up in Hollywood until the ’70s and ’80s. Then again, Carlyle invented postmodernism in Sartor Resartus (1833), so why should anyone be surprised? Reactionaries always do it first and best.
And best of all – you can rent Africa Addio on Netflix. Alas, you’ll have to score the acid somewhere else.
April 20th, 2009 at 10:19 am
No, M and I was never induced to watch the Mondo Cane crap except when it would plague the trailers’ segment before a film.
You are insane and have the taste of a chimp with trench mouth.
In order to cleanse the rest of our palettes I offer this in memorium for JG Ballard:
Why I Want to Fuck Ronald Reagan
http://info.interactivist.net/node/3244
April 20th, 2009 at 10:27 am
Ted’s manifesto was at least sane…and made sense.
Anna, your subconscious seems to be closing in on a small realization here. Perhaps I should just be quiet, and let it do its work.
But I can’t resist letting you in on a little secret: if you want to convert someone into a reactionary, it’s actually much easier to start with a progressive than a conservative.
Your conservative is someone who believes that from 1628 to 1948 (the latter date varies – 1948 is quite hardcore as they go), Left was good and Right was bad. But since then, it is the other way around – Right is good and Left is bad.
So, for instance, the *original* Tea Party was more or less a howling communist mob. You will certainly find it described as such in accurate primary sources of the period, such as Peter Oliver. Samuel Adams and Saul Alinsky were peas in a pod. Heck, Sam Adams probably invented the Revolutionary Drug Brother handshake.
When your modern teabagger takes this criminal conspiracy as his symbol, he is indulging in the world’s oldest case of Stockholm Syndrome. He is camouflaging his sensible and reactionary goals under a pile of 200-year-old Communist propaganda, which smelled just as much in the 1770s as it does now. Of course this is not going to work – you guys sniff him out instantly, and ridicule him for his ignorance of S&M. Once a peasant, always a peasant.
Whereas for a progressive, especially a really hardcore balls-to-the-wall ironclad Ted Kaczynski progressive, it’s all so simple. Everything you think of as good is actually evil.
So, for example, Ted Kaczynski: evil. Amazing! Unthinkable! I know! But if you can just get yourself to lick this one little corner of the pill, you may be on the road to recovery.
Now, is it a perfect inverse? Is everything you think of as evil, actually good?
No, because all the word “right” means is “not left.” Left is you and your friends. Right is anyone who isn’t in your little club. Or, more to the point, right is all things under heaven and earth which are not in your philosophy. Some of these things, like Hitler, are evil. Others, like Metternich, Frederick II or Ian Smith, are good. And a few, like Cromwell, Pinochet, or Verwoerd, are debatable. One must examine the particulars.
So I will be happy to admit that Ted Kaczynski is my evil twin. The question is: are we identical, or fraternal? I’m afraid you’ll have to do your own legwork on that one.
April 20th, 2009 at 10:39 am
Reading your gibberish makes me want to exhume Ronald Reagan and fuck him.
April 20th, 2009 at 10:46 am
Never has a man who has bent himself been able to make others straight.
Mencius, Works
Chinese Confucian philosopher (371 BC – 289 BC)
April 20th, 2009 at 10:47 am
guffaw
April 20th, 2009 at 11:55 am
One can never accuse Anna of having class.
April 20th, 2009 at 12:21 pm
Au contraire, mon right wing frere.
Referencing a JG Ballard piece to both commemorate his death and use it as intended– to hoist a bloviating right wing psycho on his own pitard…and then to turn his own handle against him…why thats not only classy, but witty.
You are just too dumb of a fuck to figure it out.
April 20th, 2009 at 1:20 pm
People without talent have to resort to profanity for expression.
April 20th, 2009 at 1:30 pm
Gosh, Woody, maybe if I had grown up reading the encyclopedia and Superman comics I could have had all your ‘talent’ for parroting every jingoistic sound byte blaring from a TV glued to Fox News.
Profanity is stupidity. And that makes you a right profane sinner.
April 20th, 2009 at 1:33 pm
Profanity is also claiming to befriend the father of a black child bombed to bits in her church…and then spending your adult years posting racist tat on a blog.
April 20th, 2009 at 3:13 pm
Anna, we never talked about his daughter’s death. Also, I don’t parrot material. It’s original. You do know, don’t you, that you’re free to leave the Democratic plantation and become an independent thinker?
April 20th, 2009 at 3:21 pm
Anna, all I can say is: don’t leave the lens cap on for that one.
Reagan talked a good line in the ’60s. But by the time the electorate realized he was right, Alzheimer’s had already turned him into a nice old man. America needed a Sulla. It got a Lepidus. And the bow of Ulysses remains unbent.
April 20th, 2009 at 4:06 pm
Woody you not only parrot,but squawk. And your parroting is so off the map it becomes parody.
April 20th, 2009 at 10:12 pm
Mencius is actually less like the Unabomber and more like “Ignatius” in “A Confederacy of Dunces.”
April 21st, 2009 at 12:11 am
“the greatest documentary of all time: Africa Addio.”
As much as I hate these acronyms – “LOL” – You’re a lot dumber than you rather desperately try to sound…
April 21st, 2009 at 12:37 am
But thanks for asking about my balls…
April 21st, 2009 at 12:53 am
If anyone is interested in Mencius mental state (yeah, I know…but there might be one or two), you can check out the cheap, turgid piece of shit he things is “the greatest documentary of all time” (with incredibly cool helicopter shots of genocide, etc. etc. ) at the link blow. That narration alone – all other questions about its “documentary” provenance aside – qualifies it as one of the worst psuedo-docs ever. Jacopetti isn’t even close to being a documentary innovator – he’s the globetrotting grandfather of cheesy, exploitative “reality shows.”
http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/africa-addio/
April 21st, 2009 at 5:31 am
Reg, see my reference to Africa Addio above—considered so bad when it came out it sparked the first anti racist protest in German history!
April 21st, 2009 at 5:35 am
Anyway, what is fascinating about blog comments sections is that it invites the pathological strata within the collective to flay themselves publicly. Its also creepy and confirms all ones worst fears. And proves over and over the genius of Jung.
April 21st, 2009 at 7:01 am
“what is fascinating about blog comments sections is that it invites the pathological strata within the collective to flay themselves publicly.”
What is even more fascinating is the inability of the most pathologically profuse posters to see any disorder in themselves.
I forget who it was that recognized this politically disability, and the first to correctly coin it an actual ‘mental disorder’.
April 21st, 2009 at 7:03 am
You need a job Anna.
April 21st, 2009 at 7:04 am
Not a psychiatrist.
April 21st, 2009 at 11:34 am
yawn.
April 21st, 2009 at 1:18 pm
And, apparently, some sleep.
April 21st, 2009 at 2:43 pm
Wonderful! I hope you at least made it through the chicken scene, Reg and Anna. Of course, Africa Addio really needs to be seen on the big screen. But even a postage stamp is better than nothing, especially if you’ve got the LSD.
After you’ve made it through this harrowing, brilliant, groundbreaking work of art, and you’ve started to come down off the peak, go directly to Froude – The English in the West Indies, or, The Bow of Ulysses (1888). Froude was Regius Professor at Oxford, I’ll have you know, and his history of England between Henry and Elizabeth is not bad neither. But the Bow is something else.
After that – you might be ready for the Carlyle. Drink some coffee to keep the rush going. Jacopetti and Prosperi will crush your soul, Froude will freeze-dry it, Carlyle will grind it into powder. But don’t worry: everything that goes up, must come down. (Oh, and those “floaters” are just part of your eye.)
April 21st, 2009 at 3:05 pm
Mencius, you’re fun, like having a puppy mascot around. I mean that tenderly and sincerely. You remind me of my undergrad days, when angsty literature majors were trying to outduel each other with macabrer-(yes, I think that French word deserves the blunt and sadistic imposition of an English inflectional morpheme!)-than-thou theories and philosophical treatises. They weren’t getting laid, of course. But what skin-tingling prose!
Ouch, on second thought, given your “orc” and “troll” references on your blov- er, blog, I see you might not have made it into the cool-kid-lit club after all. Dungeons and Dragons and the parents’ basement? Now that, my sad friend, is indeed soul-crushing. *Shudder*
“Therefore howl doth Moab for Moab, all of it doth howl, For the grape-cakes of Kir-Hareseth it meditateth, Surely they are smitten.
April 21st, 2009 at 5:24 pm
Update on the post from the perspective of the journalist….
The Truth About My Arrest at USC – by John Ziegler (Selections)
April 21st, 2009 at 6:05 pm
such sublime wankery!
April 21st, 2009 at 6:05 pm
“Drink some coffee to keep the rush going.”
Wow – edgy stuff. But, personally, I don’t read anything published after 1887. ‘Cuz I’m a fuckin’ REACTIONARY, baby !!!!
April 21st, 2009 at 6:09 pm
# Sergio Says:
April 21st, 2009 at 6:05 pm
such sublime wankery!
Rarely do I echo Sergio, but I’m glad I don’t have Mencius’ dry cleaning bill.
April 21st, 2009 at 6:28 pm
The woody one will never die because he keeps getting infusions.
See, here’ s one from me even. Enough to get him through another week of taunts.
April 21st, 2009 at 7:59 pm
I think M has been watching too many John Malkevich movies.
April 21st, 2009 at 8:04 pm
Johnny Z has come very close to making outright death threats against Couric, as noted in the Atlantic profile.
I can’t wait to see how he answers for that in court, should he make good on his threat to seek legal action.
April 21st, 2009 at 11:32 pm
If you “free thinkers” are not free thinking enough to acknowledge a cynical publicity stunt when you see one than you are obviously not that free at all. Mr. Moore had plenty of critics on the Left have any number of public figures that speak from that ideological corner.
Ted Kaczynski was not “progressive,” at least not according to the modern usage of the word. Obviously Mencius has not bothered to read his manifesto. He was against technology and progress while a “communist” like say, Marx, or hell even the USSR were all about modernization. They believed the capitalism failed to equally distribute the benefits of modernity; check out historical materialism. Communism in his thought is supposed to result in more progress, more modernization, more technology, etc…
Ted and his gang of anti-civilization kooks are reactionary, actually conservative. They want to go back, not just to mythical conceptions of the nuclear family but way back to hunter and gather societies. They are even more reactionary than most religious kooks. If you read some of the anti-civilization folks (John Zerzan being the foremost or check out a mag called Green Anarchy) that actually praise Ted, you will find that they loath “leftists” and leftist thought. Further you will find that the early Earth First and radical environmentalists like Dave Foreman and Ed Abbey also loathed leftists and were politically conservative and reactionary. Sorry to state the facts here…
We can go even further with this and remind everyone that the worst act of domestic terrorism was of course brought to us by radical right wingers. That of course was the Oklahoma City bombing.
It is all very very funny to see psuedo-intellectuals defending kooky publicity stunts. USC is the bastion of conservatism in Los Angeles so it can hardly be argued that this was a liberal conspiracy. Next time an anti-globalization protest goes down I will wait for these noble conservatives to stand up for the rights of the law abiding protesters. Not going to happen!
April 22nd, 2009 at 5:13 am
Spoken like a true leftist GM.
It is all very very funny to see pseudo-intellectuals shift all things kooky and reactionary to the right.
Kooky and reactionary was invented in the ’60s by the left and many have yet to grow-up into responsible adults.
April 22nd, 2009 at 5:19 am
Including the unprofessional old fools in our Universities that taught them how to be kooky and reactionary.
April 22nd, 2009 at 10:05 am
The Poetry of Dick Cheney
I’m one of those people
who
believes that part of the greatness
of the United States
is
our private sector.
It’s what we do as
private citizens
for ourselves…
and our companies.
I think we have to be very,
very cautious.
I think we’ve gone beyond
what reasonably we could expect
by way of intrusion
into
the
private sector.
April 22nd, 2009 at 10:16 am
As far as I know, USC is an open campus and the First Amendment still has sway inside campus boundaries.
Gak. It’s remarkable that so many Americans are so utterly clueless about the law and the Constitution. The First Amendment, if you would bother to read it, is about restricting legislative bodies and what laws they can enact; it’s meaningless drivel to talk about whether it “holds sway” in some location or another. The legislature hasn’t restricted what John Ziegler can say, inside the USC campus boundaries or anywhere else, so the First Amendment is irrelevant. But owners of private property, who are not legislatures — duh — can decide that they don’t want people on their property for any number of reasons, including harassing other people on their property, and can require that they leave under trespassing laws. You can debate the ethics or wisdom of such decisions by private property owners, but invoking the First Amendment is foolishly ignorant.
April 22nd, 2009 at 10:40 am
But, instead of an apology, all I hear, is he’s a Toad (who in no way commits journalism).
I guess one must take the graduate course in false dichotomies to come up with such masterful non sequiturs.
April 22nd, 2009 at 10:53 am
If USC was NOT a private campus this wouldn’t have happened, which is depressing because in these type of Matters USC should act like a public institution instead of like some greedy corporation that is hiding something.
Oh, John Ziegler wouldn’t have disturbed the peace, resisted arrest, and generally made an ass of himself (as if he is capable of anything else) on a public campus? And what is USC trying to hide? Like some greedy corporation, yet? You do yourself no favors with such blatant stupidity and intellectual dishonesty.
April 22nd, 2009 at 5:32 pm
Jim R. Would love to know how you can deduce my ideological position from what I wrote?
The Kooky and reactionary right existed before the sixties. In fact William F. Buckley did a fine job of squashing them. Poor guy is rolling in his grave.
April 22nd, 2009 at 6:47 pm
Uber Cow
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/apr/23/nazi-culture-film-hitler
Terrific sociological commentary…and satire.
April 24th, 2009 at 12:45 pm
I think everyone need to relax an watch Pink Flamingo with a friend.
July 21st, 2009 at 11:20 pm
[...] I linked to Marc Cooper’s site regarding the John Ziegler/Annenberg fracas, as Marc had some additional information and quotes [...]
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